Marine Railways

[Cnewbert]

@BraceMaker

@Sethro

@motoxr

(And anyone else with experience on the topic who cares to chime in...)

On the current thread about draining bilge water in a 2015 Prostar on a marine railway I believe you all mentioned you use a railway system to launch and haul out your boats.  Railways have always interested me as an alternative to a boat slip with a typical lift for a variety of reasons, not the least of which would be greater ease of boat care and maintenance for routine things like oil changes, hull wipe downs after each use, weekly Babe's Boat Bright treatments etc. that are difficult or impractical on lifts (other than platform lifts). As well, I like the idea of our boat being out of and off the water, on land, during extreme weather conditions that occasionally destroy docks and boat lifts, along with any boats left on them.  

My wife and I are currently in the market for a lake house. Though our desired lake does not have any suitable properties presently on the market (nor has it for some time) we are patient and confident we'll find something within the year.  In the event a prospective house has no existing covered lift, or not an adequate lift for our boat, we'd then need to either have one built, or look at alternatives such as a railway.  Without presently knowing whether or not there might be permit prohibitions for such systems on our lake, or whether or not a prospective location would have adequate water depth without requiring an excessively long railway, I'm trying to gather as much information as I can about them in the event we find a property in need of some launch/haul out system where a railway might be one option.

I'd be interested to learn which manufacturer built your railway along with any pros or cons you wish to share about your system.   I know in at least one case from the drain plug post boat houses were not allowed on the lake, so a railway was your only alternative. But from the perspective of experience, and if your lake property allowed you the option, would you still use a railway or would you prefer a slip with a covered lift?  

I understand the length of the individual railway is probably the biggest factor in the time it takes to launch and haul out, but do you find your railway systems generally efficient for this process or are they excessively slow and time consuming.  i.e. compared to a lift, does the railway take much longer to launch and haul out?

Also, do you find them durable and generally free of breakdowns of any sort?  Do you find they require frequent maintenance compared to a lift?  (I know there are a number of different lift systems... hydraulic, electric, hand wheel, cantilever etc.  I'm just trying to get a general comparative feel between railways and lifts).

Lastly, in general, I'd appreciate any insights at all about railways or cautions that may not be discussed in the manufacturers' promotional materials.  Anything you care to share would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks!

[motoxr]

Good afternoon, all great questions to consider before making the decision. As an aside, I am in Ontario, Canada, so we do have to consider how to manage the ice. With that being said, so do people with lift systems.

For me, we have a bit of ice movement so I  remove one section of track that goes between the water and land portion such that it mitigates any concerns with ice. I also have a friend with a setup such that the in water portion gets cantilevered out of the water during the winter. However, I do not need anything that elaborate.

My boat is not covered once it's on the land. Yet that me be a project for this summer, building a boat port on land. The key thing I love about the marine railway is it allows me to pull the boat out of the water ever weekend and then immediately wipe it down to keep the hull clean. Further, it protects the boat from being out of the water when I'm not at the cottage.

Mine is a Naylor system (I will send a separate note with the website) and it uses an electric winch to pull the carriage up.

The only issue I have experienced is with some rust and I then simply replaced a couple of the sections. Rather than buying the sections from Naylor, I saved a bunch of $ and bought U channel from a local metal supermarket and then made up my own sections.

Finally, I would endorse doing this route again.

Best regards.

Doug 

 

[BraceMaker]

Sort of putting the marine railway in front of the house.

I have a love hate relationship with them.  The only scenario in which I think they make sense is if you have some provision on shore to build out a covered enclosure near the water. 

Think how big your boat is in your driveway on a trailer.  Now envision this in front of your lake house blocking your view of the lake.  It is going to be far more obtrusive than sitting down on a lift in the water. 

Also now all the area the tracks run on you have to be careful of, hard to mow around the tracks, kids running or swimming or dogs playing you have this track in the grass and when the boat isn't sitting there they can be hard to see particularly if you have a longer lawn.  Now if you have some sort of boat house or deck to haul it under, or if you have a ton of yard between you and the lake these make a lot of sense.

In the lake I was discussing the big thing was you just couldn't get a permit to enlarge the old boat houses.  If you were "lucky" enough to have one its an antique from a time that boats were far smaller so quite a few people managed to get special permission to move those antique boat houses up onto shore, put them on a foundation that raised them up, install larger doorways and often elongate the boat house to hold a larger boat.  Then they had a nice solid concrete foundation to hook the railway to and in winter most people do like Doug and they remove one or two sections so that the ice doesn't damage anything and then reinstall that in spring.  I've met a few who disconnected it and just dragged those sections out and dropped them underwater.

Another lake around me has concrete or metal seawalls everywhere and most of the houses are only about 15' from shore many of them have garages built under the decks and they have railways up into the houses.  But again as the boats have gotten bigger so many of them now just have docks and covered lifts because you cannot fit a boat and its hard to make those garages from the 1980s big enough for new boats.

 

So to each their own money no object I would go boat house, then boat lift, then a nice covered boat lift and then finally railway into my yard into an on shore boat house.

 

[Sethro]

@Cnewbert  My railway is all homemade, and I used a trailer that was converted into a dolly.  The U-channel is embedded in the concrete ramp and boathouse.  I have U-channel with pipe welded underneath for support that attaches to the seawall which are 12' long and ultimately sit at a 12 degree angle to the bottom of the river.  Those rails then attach to a 20' section of rails that lay on the contour of the bottom.  Water depth at the seawall is about 2' and it's a gradual slope down to about 7' at the end of the 32' of railway.  The bottom is very firm gravel.  I'll attach some pictures that show the components.  The maintenance I've done is washing it down with water each year when I remove them and making sure the cable is lubricated and inspected often, and of course replaced when necessary. You do need to be cautious about standing behind the boat when there is tension on the cable for general safety reasons.  I also clean out the rails almost every time before I use them with a long 1/2" pipe and a piece of metal cut to the shape of the inside of the U-channel.  Small pebbles/rocks often get washed into the rails and can cause the dolly to stop and create slack in the cable till it breaks loose.  My next door neighbor had to add a couple of new cross braces after about 25 years of use and they are essentially the same materials and design as mine.

I had a lift at my parent's house for over 20 years before I was able to purchase my own waterfront home.  I've been putting in/taking out/maintaining free standing lifts for well over 30 years, and I sitll have one for my fishing boat.  My dad still has one that I have the honor of taking in and out every year.  The criteria for my waterfront home purchase was an acceptable location and a suitable boathouse...that was pretty much it.  My wife had to like the house, and I had to like the boathouse.  That's my hint that I prefer the railway/boathouse over a free standing lift...absolutely no comparison in my mind.  Now, a nice covered slip in a climate where the lift can stay in year round might be a different story.

Let me know if you have any other specific questions!

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by Sethro

[Andre]

@Sethro Nice set up! How long does it take each way ? 

Video would be great! 🙂

[Sethro]

You know, I’ve never timed it. It’s quite slow, and I’d say it’s probably close to 1:30  

I’ve often commented how slow it is, but my neighbor always says slow and steady wins the race. I don’t really have a desire to speed it up, but someday I’ll add a remote. It’s just an off the shelf Davit Master winch.

I forgot to attach a pic of how it is secured at the seawall. This was freshly painted which turned out to be a waste of time. And I actually prefer the warn metal look now. 

Edited March 14, 2023 by Sethro

[Cnewbert]

@Sethro  thanks for all your pics and info!  I admire your inventiveness!  In our case, winter ice would not be a factor in the decision whether to choose a railway over a lift as we're in FL.  But we face somewhat complex square foot restrictions on docks, decks, slips and requirements for light penetration that a railway might possibly avoid. That's why I'm trying to get a better grasp on the pros and cons of railways and whether to even consider one.  I see you use channels for the tracks.  I wonder if a conventional type track would require any cleaning as they would seem to be unlikely to collect small rocks and pebbles like your channels do.  Thoughts on that? 

@BraceMakerWhile we don't have a lake house as of yet, knowing what our options are as they affect the suitability of a prospective house for our needs is important.  If a railway is a viable option to a lift, it may or may not affect our decision on purchasing a particular property, assuming no suitable dock/lift is already in place.  So I'm just trying to educate myself in advance concerning railway systems since I know nothing about them.  Your comments are valuable and appreciated!  Enclosed boat houses are no longer permitted on "our" lake.  But, depending on the size of the lot, a garage type building on land would entirely possible.  Depending again on the lot and house orientation, this may well be visually less intrusive of the lake view than a covered lift at the end of a dock.  

If money (or permits) were no object for us, I would go for a covered platform lift, and that is something we will also explore if necessary.  I love those.

@motoxras noted above, ice is no factor in FL!  But the key things you mentioned why you love your railway are exactly why they interest me.  So I thank you for your comments.  I previously found Naylor by Googling different railway manufacturers, so I already have their website.  Thanks again.  

[motoxr]

In terms of timing. My electric motor is fairly quick..it probably takes less than one minute to pull everything out of the water. Keep us posted on your progress and good luck!

[Cnewbert]

@motoxrone minute in or out of the water isn't bad at all.  If circumstances ever come to us having the option of deciding between a lift or a railway, I would want to be sure the launch and haul out times for a railway were not much longer than with a lift. That's helpful. Thanks again.

[03RLXi]

1 minute is awesome! Even several minutes is quicker than using trailer once account for back in, disconnect, reverse boat off, tie up, pull out trailer, park, walk back, etc

[Andre]

Just saw this on SIA...

https://www.ski-it-again.com/php/skiitagain.php?endless=summer&topic=Search&category=Boat_Lift&postid=65863

[thager]

@TheMS had a setup like that.

[Cnewbert]

@Andre thanks for that link Andre. I didn’t know Hewitt offered a rail system. We have a Hewitt dealer 10 minutes away, so that would be super convenient if we eventually have need of one. 

[Cnewbert]

@The_MS  thager says you have/had a railway system.  If so, and if you have the time or inclination, could you share any information, pros and cons, likes and dislikes about this alternative to a lift?  Thanks!

 

[jayski]

I have a Hewitt rail system, works great, highly recommend 

[The_MS]

I had a system that was just like the photo @Andreposted. We had a nice slope 12 to 1 on the shore line depth so it was easy to install. Pull the boat out/up into the car port and you can do all maint, detailing and work needed. We had 2 sections of rail to pull out for the winter. Easy with 4 bolts. 
much better then a roll in boat lift. 
Mine was a Hewitt roll a rail.  Made in Mn 

[VONMAN]

Keep in mind that Florida lake levels can change a lot 6 or 7 years ago a lot of boat house's couldn't be used because low lake levels. Lake Weir for example has come up 3.5 to 4 feet. With a aluminum lift you can move the lift to deeper water. If a major storm is forecast you pull the boat and store on the trailer to be safe.

Ernie Schlager

[Cnewbert]

@jayskigood recommendation.  Thanks!  I see the Hewitt system incorporates a push/pull winch drive that would be valuable given most of the lakefront properties on this lake -- at least those we'd be interested in -- have a shallow land incline leading to the water's edge.

@The_MSthank you for your input. It confirms the pros of the system that appeal to me and another thumbs up for Hewitt.

@VONMANI remember well how low the lake got 9 years ago.  However, our alternative to a rail system -- should the situation arise where we buy a property without a suitable dock/lift already in place and have to build from scratch or rebuild an existing dock/lift -- would be a covered boat slip with an overhead lift, as opposed to an in-water moveable lift.  Ideally, I'd like a platform lift though those may run into a permit issue.  In that case, we'd be high and dry like the majority on the lake if or when the lake level drops so low again.  I'm just not a fan of the in-water moveable lift option for many reasons. If the water level drops with a rail system, you can always add additional track sections to reach deeper water.  As we both know, however, certain parts of the lake have such a shallow lake bottom incline that a rail system would not be practical in the first place due to the length of track necessary even when the lake is at normal height.  So the feasibility of a rail system would depend first and foremost on the location of any property we might buy.

[On_edge]

Marine Railway alternative.