Baller alex38 Posted May 12, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 12, 2014 Looking for possible troubleshoot to 2002 SN cranks, gas not coming out of injectors, fuel pump and cell seem to be working but gas won't go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Jody_Seal Posted May 12, 2014 Baller_ Share Posted May 12, 2014 Low pressure pump most likely culprit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 12, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 12, 2014 Running now, rubbed my fingers under injector nozzles, are they gummed up? And what could be solution to that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 12, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 12, 2014 If you turn the key to on, not start, do you hear the pumps prime? This detects if you are getting power to the pumps and rules out the problematic relays. If priming, pull FCC off and check filter. Drain FCC into larger Gatorade bottle with top cutoff first. If no gas in FCC, probably low pressure pump. It puts gas into FCC for high pressure pump to send to fuel rail. If gas in FCC, could be high pressure pump. When you check for priming, you should be able to feel the low pump vibrate by putting your hand on it. The high pump is inside the FCC and harder to feel, as it hangs suspended in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 12, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 12, 2014 Pumps are priming, she's running but hesitating at high rpm (low pressure pump or high pressure pump?) Ha, was actually using a Gatorade bottle too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 12, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 12, 2014 That helps. Low pump probably not supplying enough gas to FCC. Remotely, it could be a sticky anti-syphon valve, if filters are all good. Easy to check, follow supply line back or if you are lucky and they put a red piece of tape on tank and down in bilge before the pump, pull that valve off and blow some electrical parts cleaner or brake cleaner through it. If that doesn't work, you will be buying a low pressure pump. Not a biggie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 12, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 12, 2014 Awesome help thanks guys!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller thager Posted May 12, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 12, 2014 I just had something similar on my 02. Was hesitating out of hole and at WOT. Check distributor cap for corrosion. Mine was full of green/white junk. Replaced cap and rotor and all is fine. Inboard Solutions Tim White has the parts and knowhow. Thanks Tim!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 13, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 13, 2014 @thager Interesting, how similar were your symptoms? Was it not even starting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller thager Posted May 13, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 13, 2014 Had one no start event. Then would bog out of the hole if I cobbed the throttle out of the hole, followed by a hesitation near WOT with an occasional backfire which I would not get if I eased the throttle up. Absolutely no symptoms since changing the distributor and rotor. As long as I was at it I changed out the plugs and wires too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller AggieSkier Posted May 13, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 13, 2014 If you have tried the above recommendations with no success. Inspect the fuel hose inside the FCC. The High Pressure Pump in the FCC is suspended on a 2.5" or so long hose. My fuel line had a crack in it and engine would hesitate at high rpm. Got progressively worse. The Low Pressure Pump has a screen filter inside that may be partially clogged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 15, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 15, 2014 replaced pump, old pump had some debris in it, boat still would not start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 15, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 15, 2014 @AB still no luck but I do have red tape marking a line out of my tank, where is valve? Right on the tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Jody_Seal Posted May 15, 2014 Baller_ Share Posted May 15, 2014 Until you put a fuel pressure gauge on the system you are pissing into the wind. The Anti siphon valve is a hose barb fitting that is spring loaded inside with a ball and a seat at the top of the fuel tank. Grawdew and debris can block the operation of the valve. identification is the fitting is longer overall then the return line fitting. I utilize a remote fuel supply when I need to isolate the boat tank. Many potential areas can cause fuel delivery problems. Bad fuel, no fuel, blocked anti siphon valve, debris build up around pick up screen in tank, collapsed inner liner on 3/8" feed fuel line due to ethanol. failed low pressure pump, failed high pressure pump, incorrect assembly of FCC including feed tube in FCC compromised, wire off FCC high pump, failed fuel pressure regulator. Fuel pump relay.fuel pump driver in ECM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 17, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 17, 2014 @Jody_Seal if I know low pressure pump is dispensing into FCC, can I narrow it down to flow of fuel between FCC and throttle body? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 18, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Alex, there is a test to check flow out of the low pressure pump, you basically feed the line going to the FCC into a gas can and measure how much flows in a set period of time. It is in the PCM diagnostic manual in my office somewhere. The other test is at the Schrader valve on the rail, which is on the starboard side of the engine on top of the manifold. It looks like a tire valve and you attach a fuel pump pressure gauge to it. If I remember right, it should be around 35-40 psi. JAyG is correct, the high pressure pump hangs suspended down into the FCC and just blows gas up to the fuel rail. I have been told those do not go out that often, but the hose can get brittle and crack, not giving a good seal. The anti-syphon valve is on top of the tank, and you shouldn't have to remove the tank to get to it. Loosen the fuel line clamp and pull the fuel line off, then unscrew the valve. Clean it out and give it a try. The Ethanol content in the gasoline can cause it to gum up and not flow properly. It is sort of a long shot for you, but a cheap one. My ECM was going bad, so it was causing real funky stuff to happen to my fuel relays, and fuel supply on the rail. I hope you are not headed down that path. It unfortunately does not have any code errors, so you eliminate everything else, then spend the big bucks. If you have a buddy with a GT, maybe you can convince him to let you swap out the ECM and give it a try. It would save you a lot of time, if this is ultimately what is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 18, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 18, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 @AB was not starting one if the issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 18, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 18, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 @Jody_Seal @AB there was definitely debris in old pump, looks like sand, salt or granulated sugar, and metal shavings, could this affect high pressure pump too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 18, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Alex, my engine would start sometimes and then not others. Would run ok and then start cutting out. I found that when my pumps wouldn't prime, if I tapped on the ECM, they would prime as I tapped on it. That was pure luck on my part, but I had already tested the low pump, new relays (anyone with a GT should have spares), pulled anti syphon valve, and then pulled the tank to look in it to make sure junk wasn't blocking the pickup. Bought a fuel pressure gauge from Autozone and had all sorts of crazy readings from normal to almost nothing. The hi pressure pump sits inside the filter, so it would be a stretch that junk would get past the filter to the hi pump. Do you have a new filter on? As Jody said, the pressure gauge will tell you if the pumps are putting out consistent pressure. If they are working and the engine misses, it is electrical or something else, but not pumps. If pressure is lost then you have to make sure the supply is good. I think I was told the hi pressure pump is usually an on off rule of failure unless the line is bad as mentioned above. I replaced the line on top of my hi pump to no avail. And the fittings are small and a pita to mess with. By the way, I replaced the distributor cap and rotor too, which didn't help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 18, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Alex, here is a link to a thread where I was getting some help by some pretty engine-smart guys. It might help you see the path to follow. I think there are some videos embedded in there showing the fuel pump pressure readings, and how to troubleshoot though it. http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=25775&PN=1&title=99-sn-gt40-fuel-supply Also, if you don't have, I highly recommend printing out the PCM manual for the GT40. It is loaded with info on how to diagnose and test. http://www.planetnautique.com/CorrectCraftManuals/GT-40%20Service%20Manual.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 18, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Nice,thank you I'm a 5.0 pro sport though not a gt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 18, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 I think they work a lot alike though. You have the same FCC, low and hi pumps, 2 fuel relays, and an ECM on back of the engine. EFI with a fuel rail, etc... Even if it was a carb motor, the fuel delivery and ECM would be similar. The thread I sent you goes through the "elimination" stage to rule out possibilities. You could just jump right to swapping similar ECM's with a buddy. I do not know if a GT ECM will work with a Pro Sport. You could compare part #'s from the PCM manuals for GT and P Sport, and they may use the same model, or not. GT's would be easier to get a hold of. I hope it is something else, but the thread will help in the diagnosis of other issues to rule out. It was a painful process and I feel for you. You could just drop it off at the dealer too, but I thought I would save myself 4 hours of driving, but spent a lot more in the end. I learned a lot, but I think I would be fine without it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 18, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Plugs are not sparking fyi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 18, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 That is why you put a pressure gauge on rail and run the engine. If the pressure is constant and the engine cuts out, you eliminate a bunch of fuel issues. If you have original distributor cap and rotor, that would be very suspicious. There is a trouble shooting path for no spark but you said not getting gas. If it runs and runs poorly it could be the cap. If it doesn't run at all, with no spark it still could be the cap, but could be other electrical stuff. You need to eliminate some of the variables. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 18, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Thank you for your experience @AB, people here are second to none. Way to many variables for this work-to-ski-die-hard. Gonna spend my energy on getting it to the dealer and properly diagnosed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller skier2788 Posted May 18, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 @alex38 if it turns out to be an ecm or something electrical let me know. I recently upgraded to ZO and have a complete wiring harness throttle body and ecm that came off an 02 Nautique 343. Could be cheaper than buying a new one from the dealer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller A_B Posted May 18, 2014 Baller Share Posted May 18, 2014 Let us know how it plays out. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller alex38 Posted May 19, 2014 Author Baller Share Posted May 19, 2014 I will keep you posted (awesome pun), for sure @skier2788, if that part is a match you may be hearing from me, now where did I park that trailer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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