Need help at 35 off

[Skoot1123]

I know there are a lot of tips out there for 22 and even 28 off, but I haven't seen many tips for 32 and 35 off skier's. Tried my first or second shot at 35 off this past Monday. The pullout, gate, AND turn at 1 ball was "great". . . . . but there was enough slack line that it hit the water as I made the turn and was going to reach for the handle. I wisely let it go - not worth getting a hit like that for the "whole" 1 ball. Anything that really stood out to those that run this frequently? Thanks!

[Chef23]

@Skoot1123 I haven't run 35 yet but I have gotten to 4 ball a bunch and do regularly get out of 1 ball without a ton of slack. If there was slack line in the water then the pullout, gate and turn at 1 ball were not great. My guess without seeing any video is that you need to be much higher on the boat during the pullout so that you can work hard to the second wake then change edges and ride the rope out to 1 ball.

 

It sounds counter-intuitive but I believe you weren't carrying enough speed behind the boat to swing out to 1 ball. Whenever I get a lot of slack at 1 it is usually because I was too narrow at the gates, didn't generate enough speed to get width then have to either pull long or ride flat for a half a second to be sure I get the ski around the ball.

[Than_Bogan]

Exactly what Chef23 said. But I'll say it all again with different words just because sometimes that works:

 

The huge slack means you're arriving there with too much speed, and the wildly uintuitive solution is: You need more speed. But it needs to be earlier so that you have the momentum to get out there without continuing to load the line. Because of the geometry, speed earlier is cross-course (good), but speed later is down-course (bad == slack).

 

One other note: It's OK to feel a little narrow if your speed is right. Focusing too much on getting wide leads to late pulling and the problems mentioned above. That's almost more of a -38 tip, but it can apply somewhat to learning -35 as well.

[Skoot1123]

@Chef23 - I was affraid of that! It just felt so good going into one ball I was ecstatic! @Than - I like the explanation of speed earlier is cross-course, but later is down-course. Maybe someone can comment on getting the acceleration RIGHT after the turn instead of behind the boat (pendulum type skiing). Seems that at 32 you tend to get the acceleration phase right out of the turn rather than behind the boat....

[Than_Bogan]

Well, I guess I wouldn't say you want to accelerate like hell right off the ball. Ideally you want to keep your speed around the turn so you don't have to do a tremendous amount of acceleration right there.

 

But it's definitely true that the duration of the acceleration phase gets shorter with every shortening, forcing you to be more efficient and not waste any of it. Build speed while you have the chance because in the blink of an eye the rope is going to swing up to a big angle and you won't be able to build speed any more -- at least not usefully.

[Chef23]

I am with @Than_Bogan you should never be accelerating like hell right off the bat. You really want to finish the turn and wait for the boat to pick you up then accelerate between the start of the white water and the second wake.

[Skoot1123]

@Chef23 and @Than - guess I really need to work on casting my ski outward and carrying enough speed to get it back under the rope before hooking back on with my other hand. I know that when I do get it right, there is no better feeling in the world - I call it "EASY SKIING" but when I get a little slack, then slack control mode kicks in and its a "scramble." Guess I need to work on the intensity variation and playing around with "skills." Those buoys just want to make you go around them though. Hard to balance all the stuff out!

[PatM]

Hold on to the handle with two hands as long as possible. Handle control is the key to 35.

[Ilivetoski]

@Skoot1123 the pendulum effect. I love it. What I used to do that was hurting me there was that out of my turn I was standing up, then leaning as I approched the wake. What I learned (and what it sounds like you need to do) is out of the buoy, after you make your turn, just wait the slack out. Dont stand up, dont add more angle to your ski. Worded another way: come out of the buoy with the same amount of angle that you came into it with. Trust me that gets more effective acceleration out of the buoy, it gets you corss course not down course.

[jRoe]

I am a expert at hacking at -35..my bouy account is 98..I have been working on that pass for like, i dont know at least 8 year,.my lastest hair brain, is to aim for the left hand gate (my ski partners idea so we would not miss the gate) well I have run 22 out of the last 24 35offs.. so try that

[Laz]

Every time I have started working on a new line length, I have gotten huge slack at 1. I think I'm starting to figure this out. Each new line length requires a bit more speed behind the boat and an earlier edge change. The video of Seth Stisher and his iPad has helped me understand a bit more. Then rope control is everything.

[mwetskier]

got a link to that seth vid?

[davemac]

[mwetskier]

ok that link lead to this link

where seth skis on a shorter and shorter rope and after he gets to the blue rope at 2.20 it looks like he changes edge later and later. realy late on the grey rope (sorry dont know what the colors mean) so isnt that the opposite of his advice in the first vid? Im confused as to witch is the right way.

[mwetskier]

wow thats cool I pasted the link and the video pops up here

[gregy]

@mwetskier Seth mentions in the 1st video that instinctively when a person gets late they feel like they need to pull longer. Seth also states in several videos that he doesn't have perfect technique. Most of Seth's edge changes are right behind the boat. He does an exceptional job for the most part of make early edge changes.

[SkiJay]

@mwetskier What @gregy says. This recent video of Seth is interesting in a number of ways. It's sterling Stisher to be humble enough to post a video of himself struggling like everyone else does in this sport. And while he of all people is clear on the goal and importance of an early edge change, he too can fall back on pulling long when late. And when he does, he gets slack and his pass suffers. Maybe it's not as much slack and trouble as we would get, he is a pro after all, but he is still subject to the same laws of physics that we are.

 

It's also interesting to see he is sticking with the two-handed gate, and even more interesting how his technique has evolved towards Nate Smith's with regard to dropping deep into a short hard cut in the first white water for a burst of cross-course speed.

 

I thought that as Nate evolved, his style would smooth out and look a bit more like Seth's beautiful poetry in motion "Random Slalom Pass." Apparently I got that backwards. Big surprise ... evolution favors success.