Administrators Horton Posted June 18, 2012 Administrators Share Posted June 18, 2012 http://www.ballofspray.com/images/stories/S2.jpg The 2012 S2 is the second ski from the HO Syndicate product line in the “Speed” or S range. The S2 was shaped by a five time world champion , Bob LaPoint, with input from his brother, Kris LaPoint, as well as the HO Syndicate pro team.Every high end ski can be described as performing better when the skier does all the right things. Some skis challenge the skier to be very technical, and some skis allow the easier to do all the right things. The S2 forgives sloppy skiing, but more importantly, the S2 makes it easier to do the right things. From the Second Wake to the ballThe S2 maintains angle off the second wake and draws a path wide of and in front of the ball as consistently as any ski ever made. As with any ski, staying connected to the boat on the way out to the ball line will result in additional width, but if you struggle with this skill, the S2 will still get you surprisingly wide. More than any ski that I can recall, the S2 rides with a constant attitude on the water. Forward and backward weight shifts by the skier seem to be muted. To say this another way, the S2 is extremely stable in the pre-turn. This attribute makes it easier for the skier to think about what he/she is doing. From the ball to the Second wakeUnless pushed with excessive aggression, the S2 will exit the ball with the tip down and head across course without any fuss. Should the skier apply extra lean on the way to the wakes, the S2 will deliver a surprising burst of speed. Off Side TurnThe S2 is not radical or dramatic at Off Side turn, but you can depend on it. Just about every time you turn your Off Side, you will exit in control and with ample angle. Dependable may not sound sexy, but if you want a new personal best, you want a ski that turns your Off Side dependably. With stock settings, the S2 never feels like the tail is sliding. Instead, the whole ski carves back toward the centerline. The result is a turn that ends further inside the ball line and allows for the skier to put the power down right behind the boat.http://www.ballofspray.com/images/stories/S2-2.jpghttp://www.ballofspray.com/images/stories/S2-2-2.jpg On Side TurnAs much or more than any other ski on the market, the On Side turns on the S2 are nearly symmetrical to the Off Side. The ski’s longitudinal stability means that the ski naturally rides with the tip down allowing for a carving On Side turn. The ski can be forced to make abrupt changes in direction, but if the skier is patient, the S2 will draw a tight arc out of On Side and will carry speed back to the center line. Quirks and NotesI rode the ski with the DFT back further than stock for a while. On Side turns were sharper, but the whole skiing experience was not as smooth. My final fin numbers were roughly stock but I skied best with the bindings at 29 3/8” for the 67.5” ski.http://www.ballofspray.com/images/stories/S2-8.jpg BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller JAS Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 John do you typically run your bindings back on other skis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller thager Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 MS is waiting on one. Bet it "rocks for a week. Then back to the Monza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted June 18, 2012 Baller_ Share Posted June 18, 2012 Was surprised to see boots back from stock that far. Granted mine is the 66.5 but forward of stock seemed better. I may be to far but I went with what several other suggested and it worked. Did try back from stock and all was not good, bad in fact. What made back better for you vs stock or forward? I totally agree with the review. I am becoming a calmer skier because of the S2. To not crank turns and relying on the ski to carve back to the wake, has not been easy for me. I've been the driver of the skies I've been on in the past. Relying and trusting the design of this ski to do most of the work that far off the ball has been a slow trust. To me the potential is unreal. When it does happen it's fantastic. I'm a ball off my typical practice score (way less skiing then last yr or yr before) but totally feel like I've just tapped what it can do. I'll add that my back has never been better, from the pull-up out of the water (wider is better) to the lack of hits off the ball. That alone was worth the price tag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 18, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 18, 2012 @JAS a little on some skis but not as much as the S2. I suspect that the stock # a little far forward and so I am just a little back of how I would spec stock. (yes - I know that BLP and KLP have forgotten more that I will ever know. No disrespect!) BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller aussiemc Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 I've been on a 66.25" S2 since November 2011, and initially set up just forward of stock binding position. Ski was great, and took me to new practice and tournament PB's (1@ 28off). After a conversation with Karina at the Australian Open (in which she said that HO's tend to work a little better with bindings back), I moved my binding back one hole and again I set more PB's.(4 @ 28off) I have been contemplating moving forward again, once I start skiing in September to see if it makes any difference, but I do know with my technique & at my level the ski works well at 29 3/8" with a reflex & toe loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Dirt Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 Great review. I was planning on trying one but a guy with a lot of hair sent me an obrien synergy instead of an s2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 18, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 18, 2012 @dirt why would you piss off the one guy who has all the skis. Seems like a short sighted mistake. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller jhughes Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 I love the 2nd paragraph of this review. And I really, really want to try an S2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Killer Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 @Horton How do you think it compares to some of the other skis youve been on recently? Ie A2 & Vice/strada? I just bought the vice you demod off Ron... On an A1 currently and love/hate it not sure In a strong enough skier for it but its helped me improve quite a bit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 18, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 18, 2012 @Killer comparing skis side by side is a whole other level of reviewing. As long as I have a day job I think that is out of reach. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Not_The_Pug Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 @horton, you should have seen @dirt negotiating with Greg on a hat yesterday. The price kept going up. :) But he did look really good on your A2. Thought he was going to run 39 in the 3rd round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Killer Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 @Horton I tried :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Stevie Boy Posted June 18, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 18, 2012 Ok gonna put you on the spot here John, but I will give you a get out clause. If you had a choice would you choose the S2 or the A2, Clause: for your style of skiing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SkiJay Posted June 18, 2012 Members Share Posted June 18, 2012 I like the 2nd photo. At first glance, I thought @Horton had PhotoShopped his face into a photo of MB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 18, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 18, 2012 @Stevie Boy I think I ski a higher average score on the S2. It is easier to ski on. Maybe if I was technically better or more fit I might go to the A2. My single high score on the A2 last year was higher but my average was lower. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ykoutsaris Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Mr. Horton, I'm confessing to lurking for some time but finally signed up today. Great site! Currently on an 08 Prophecy but feel like I get (excessively?) punished when I'm less than technically sound (happens a lot). Run 22'off with regularity at 34mph and have seen 5 at 28' (with higher aspirations for sure). I love the high performance of the Prophecy when I'm good, and would like to keep that performance, but would like something a lot more forgiving. Would you call the S2 a good choice with that idea in mind and at my level? Many thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 18, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 18, 2012 Yes for sure. I love that old Prophecy your are on but in the long run it might be time to put it on the wall. It is a fun ski but it is a radical design and is very hard to ski smooth on. The S2 is the other end of the spectrum. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skihack Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I've been hit again with the honeymoon effect. Sad thing is we tried this ski out for 4 weeks before we bought it. Stock settings didn't work. Shallowed up the depth to try to get the ski to turn, as well as moving dft to .750 from .730. Tried all depths from 2.475 to 2.51. Moved the bindings as far forward and back as can be. Looks like I have a skier who just can't turn a ski period. However, she can turn the crap out of an old Jobe. But consistency is a concern with the Jobe. I am beginning to believe that maybe the S2 may be above her level. She has tried a Senate C which didn't work too well either. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 21, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 21, 2012 Go back to stock. Be calm. Think about skiing not the ski. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Not_The_Pug Posted June 21, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 21, 2012 @skimech, Try to find a D3 rose (X5). Great ski for the ladies and turns. My wife ran one for a long time. Or try droping the leading edge of the fin to push the tip of the ski down, that thing will carve a turn now. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted June 21, 2012 Baller_ Share Posted June 21, 2012 @skimech. I found the S2 to be different enough from a traditional shaped ski that it requires a different mindset to ski on it. If she is a crank the ski kind of skier, I think the S2 simply doesn't do as well with that. It's a carver. I can't crank on it at the turn with my back foot like all the other skies I rode. What JTH said. Back to stock with the fin but I would add boots 1/8-1/4 forward of stock. and think about skiing calm and let it do all the work from the release to the hookup. I don't think the ski is much above anyones level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 21, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 21, 2012 Maybe binding forward on the shorter sizes but not on the 67.5 BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted June 21, 2012 Baller_ Share Posted June 21, 2012 Was speaking re a 66.5 so no idea on the 67.5. So, Johns probably right. If I say that do I have to add....and MS is wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 21, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 21, 2012 @Wish Now you are making sense BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 21, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 21, 2012 @skimech If she loved the ski for a month and now does not... it is not the ski. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller lakeaustinskier Posted June 21, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 21, 2012 I've been on an S2 for about 3 weeks and will probably switch from my Strada. Horton is right about being calm on the ski. Try smooth patient turns. In my opinion the S2 hates being cranked into and off the ball. I've had some of the best sets of my life on this ski probably because the S2 is so easy to get wide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skihack Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Here's to hoping you are right Horton. The only thing I can conclude is that every ski we have demoed or tested has been late fall or early spring with much cooler water temps, we are now getting some 100 degree days so the water is heating up fast so the water must be getting slower changing the way the ski rides. That being said, I am going to have to figure a better setup for the warmer water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skihack Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Maybe I am not measuring the dft correctly. Are you guys using the needle to measure dft or are you all laying the caliper flat up against the back of the fin? I have it set at .730 by flat against the fin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller_ Wish Posted June 21, 2012 Baller_ Share Posted June 21, 2012 .750 flat. May go back to stock though .740 flat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skihack Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 As Charlie Brown says, "oh, brother". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 22, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 22, 2012 what level skier is she? BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skihack Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 In G2 she was able to run a couple at 32 off/32mph. She grew alot this winter and was skiing her 34mph/15 off passes when she was demoing the S2. After I bought it, she has been struggling with 32mph/15off. She ran 2 and 4 at 34mph/15off in tourny this pass weekend. I am going to start another thread about ski design. Hopefully, alot of the ballers will because it looks like I don't know shi...... about skis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 22, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 22, 2012 At that size and skiing level it is really hard. I would again say go to stock and work on her skiing. Unless the ski is the wrong size, at 32 mph / 28 off fin setting and ski design are not crazy critical. All if the top skis today are not super far apart. Has she skied on other current high end skis? ... Yea lets take this to another thread. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 24, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 24, 2012 I equaled my best ever tournament pb today on the S2. Don't check the USAWS web site. The judges did not call in the score I think I got but as far as I am conserned I matched my pb. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas6 Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 @ Horton: congratulations that is fantastic! That ski really seems to be working for you; but don't forget to give yourself credit for the accomplishment! Does that mean you get to watch NASCAR today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller MattP Posted June 24, 2012 Baller Share Posted June 24, 2012 @horton don't lie we all know your 5 ball monster got you just imagined it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted June 24, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted June 24, 2012 @texas6 No need to give the judges a second try at getting it right. @OB 5@38 BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDNAH2OSKIER Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Hey all. I am Looking for a new stick. I put a set of enzo's on my V and didnt like them at all and had a fit and tossed my ski up on the platform in discuss. My ski buddy, wouldnt let me on the boat and instead threw his 2011 prophecy in the water and told me to suck it up. I did, and fell in deep like with the prophecy. Granted there is one on the boat already, and consider I am a moderately aggressive freerider with some course time in my immediate future, the S2/A2 are considerations, any other suggestions? Great thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted July 4, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted July 4, 2012 I put this ski on the rack today. Doing ski testing means I have to move on but this is a hard ski to quit. I moved my tournament PB by 3 balls on this ski. It is the real deal. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller The_MS Posted July 4, 2012 Baller Share Posted July 4, 2012 So far I have taken 3 sets on the S2 after not skiing for over a week due to a pulled calf. I must say the ski feels real stable and was very easy to pick up and ski on. 1st set I ran right down the line without any issues and it felt like I have been on the ski for awhile. The carry out off the 2nd wake is awesome. I am set up at stock with the wing at 8. The ski felt slow yesterday but today it felt a bit quicker. Its probably due to not skiing. My first thought was that it felt like the Mid that I skied on last summer. So far it feels stable, smooth and good carry off the wakes to the ball. Wish was here skiing today and he says I may want to move the binding forward. I will try that on my next set. It is one of those skis that you can hop on and ski with a good stable feeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted July 4, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted July 4, 2012 @ms Every size is different but I can tell you that bindings way back and fin a little back is the way to go on the 67.5 BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Horton Posted July 4, 2012 Author Administrators Share Posted July 4, 2012 One last thing. HO calls the one I rode a 67.5. It is really a full 68. at 190 it was almost too big. I would say skiers should round down when looking at an S2. When I say "full 68" that is kind of BS. what I mean is it is what I would expect from a 68. As I have said a million times, ski length is only a number for marketing. If you had to take a way and inch or two from the tip of your ski it will still ski the same.... Width at the bindings and or front binding position means a lot more. BABE’S ★ California Ski Ranch ★ Connelly ★ Denali ★ Goode ★ KD Skis MasterCraft ★ MasterLine ★ PerfSki ★ Radar ★ Rodics Innovation Reflex ★ S Lines ★ Stokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller Killer Posted July 4, 2012 Baller Share Posted July 4, 2012 @Horton interesting about ski size, width, etc, thanks! What is the difference in shape of the different sizes? miniscule or closer to that 1" size difference? Also, did you feel the same way about the A2 as you do the S2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller lakeaustinskier Posted July 4, 2012 Baller Share Posted July 4, 2012 I'm currently demoing both a 66.5 and a 67.5 with H2Osmosis and at the Big Dawg I had an interesting conversation with Seth Stisher. Seth told me that in his opinion the skis were significantly different skis due to the increased width of the 67.5. I did an informal measurement and the 67.5 is about 3/16 wider than the 66.5. So far the 66.5 feels plenty large for someone that is 188 and 6' 2". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller JAS Posted July 4, 2012 Baller Share Posted July 4, 2012 I'm 230 and riding a 67.5 reflex w/ rtp. 60 degree water, binding 1/8 forward and fin stock. Skis great! I tried binding back but didn't work for me. Obviously many factors but skier size may significantly contribute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef23 Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 I skied two sets on a 67.5 S2 this morning and skied within a 1/2 buoy of my practice PB in my first set. I liked the way it skis it seems to run as well as my 68.75" A1 andi think it turns sharper. I had a tendency to overturn it at 1 ball at my toughest pass. I am 6' and 210 pounds. I like the ski and am going to ski two more sets on it tomorrow. I can't take the one I skied on with me so I can go home and ski a couple of sets on my A1 and make a decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TWB Posted July 4, 2012 Members Share Posted July 4, 2012 @MS. 3 sets already. Your wife told me yesterday you haven't even skied on it yet. When I walked on the plane yesterday I said, "been skiing lately." The look on her face was, "who's this creeper." But I don't forget the BOS'ers I work with or their wives. I'm really liking my S2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baller The_MS Posted July 5, 2012 Baller Share Posted July 5, 2012 @TWB she told me she ran into a baller. I really like the ski but still have a sore calf. Took 2 sets last night and 1 set this morning with @Wish. What are you running your wing at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TWB Posted July 5, 2012 Members Share Posted July 5, 2012 Wing? What's that? I have no idea. Actually, it's my buddy's ski, so I haven't touched the fin setting, but I've been skiing on it for a month. Just sold my other ski, so my new S2 will be here any day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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