algae problem-help please

[lkb]

I have some kind of algae growing in my lake. It carpets the bottom in a layer about 1/4" thick. After a while it breaks loose in pieces and floats to the surface. When you swat the pieces or ski through them they just disappear into a cloud of mud. I have talked to a couple of experts about it. One says it is called "benthic oscillatoria". The other says he can treat it for about $5000 but can't garauntee how long it will work.

It doesn't clog up the prop or the ski. It just looks nasty. Does anybody know how to get rid of it w/o spending a fortune?

Thanks

[ForrestGump]

How is the clarity of the water? Is it dyed? Usually, algae growth on the bottom is due to the water being clear enough to let sunlight to the bottom. A lot of lakes are dyed for this reason.

[lkb]

it isn't dyed and it's very clear this summer. how much does dying cost?

[Old MS Accout]

If it is Filamentous, it likes to roll up in long strings on the beach or float up top until it beaches. We have it in our lake and we have to spray Cutrine Plus. It is a pleated Copper Sulfate product that costs about 25-30 per gallon and you need 14 gallons to take care of a 2200X300 foot lake with 5 foot average. Wipes it out with in 2 days. Only do half at a time if you have a lot of fish in the lake.         

[lkb]

It's not long and stringy. It's kinda like a mat. only a half inch thick at most.

[Marco]

We had a huge problem a few years ago with a different type of weed- sago pondgrass.  It got so bad in  a years time we could barely swim in the lake.  We dyed the lake and bought 100 sterile grass carp, and haven't had a problem since.  The bottom of the lake is completely weed free now, mostly due to the carp I think.  I don't know if grass carp eat algae, but it would be worth looking into.

[Director Darwin]

The algae MS referred to is probably what you have.  Pretty common in most parts of the country.  The remedy he provided is your best best.  Grass carp won't eat it.  I have the same issue from time to time and I have 150 grass carp in my lake.  I would try dying the water with either Aqua Shade or any other similar product that will prevent UV rays from penetrating the water.  I keep my lake dyed during the summer months and it seems to help.  Running a boat on the lake every day will oxygenate the water enough to slow down the growth of algae as well.  It thrives on hot, stagnant, clear water.

[lkb]

thanks guys. will try the cutrine plus. is it safe to ski right after application?

[Old MS Accout]

You should let it sit for a 1/2 day or so after spraying. It helps to do it in the morning on a calm day.

They also sell it in granular form if you want to spot treat.  

 

[ForrestGump]

Going forward you should probably dye your water if it's that clear.  We use the powdered bulk dye that the aquashade brand liquid dye is made from. It's a LOT cheaper, although it's damn messy. I usually end up looking like I've had carnal relations with Poppa Smurf after spreading 20 lbs of it in the water. :)

[lkb]

cool, the farmer's co-op next door has cutrine plus. MS, what kind of spray rig should I use? Did you dilute it or spray it straight?

[Old MS Accout]

We have a 25 gallon tank sparyer that we put on a mount on our platform.

We mix a 10-1

2.5 gallons per 25 gallon tank and 4 per 25 when we go down th middle of the lake for the deper water.    

[Weappa]

2gofaster - please provide more information on the bulk powder that aquashade is made from.  Thanks

We have algae growth at our lake this summer due to unusually clear water for us.  In the past, grass carp have controlled the algae.  This year we did not add to our carp population after winter kill.  The algae got out of control and we just added grass carp and are now playing catch up in controlling the algae.   

[sjholbert]

We have grass carp that eat the weeds, but they won't eat the algae.  3 weeks ago we applied Copper Sulfate (K-Tea) to Lake 1, which did kill the algae. The application cost about $450. A week later all the CS was in Lake 2, which was then algae free and Lake 1 was blooming again.  Now Lake 1 is as bad or worse than before.   Kind of expensive for 1 week of relief.

 The problem is that we have water flow into Lake1, then Lake 2, then out.  Dye's and treatments just don't last.  How can we do a maintenance treatment that will keep algae under control with the water flow conditions we have?  Someone suggested putting a gunney sack of Copper Sulfate granules at the inlet and let it dissolve into the incoming water.  Others say that the Copper Sulfate has to be sprayed on the floating algae so it binds.  I'm not knowledgeable about this but it seems to me that the CS that filtered into Lake 2 was not "applied" to the algae and yet it killed most of it.

[roda]

 

I was advised by one of the central Florida water management folks (can't remember what org he was with) that using copper sulfate will kill the algae but in many cases a new bloom will re-occur that is much larger than what you treated.  Has to do with setting up a better enviornment for it to grow the 2nd time.

 

Lots of stuff on the net about it....

http://watergardenoasis.com/Support/AlgaeArticle.html

 

-Rod

[lkb]

sjholbert, what does your algae look like?

MS and JD, All the pics I have seen on the net show filimentous to be green when it is floating. I think when mine floats to the surface it is already dead. There is nothing green left on it at that point. It's just a loosely held together thin mat kinda like cottage cheese that is the color of the mud on the lake bottom. Does that sound like filimentous?

[sjholbert]

Our algae is green fibers about 1 inch long.  when the water is calm, they clump together and float on top.  while we're skiing it's like pea soup.  I actually have a picture of it (attached.)

[Horton]

Have you tried it with oil and vinegar?

[Old MS Accout]

From what I know, it grows on the bottom and eventually fills up with oxygen and floats up and dies. I think it reacts differant around the country depending on light and temps. Cutrine Plus will kill what ever algae is present. It knocks down the oxygen level in the lake and the algae dies. We have to do our lake 2 times per summer. We have a farmer to the west of us and right after he sprays his field we will get a bloom after the first rain. We are looking into how to clean up the run off water from his fields, but when it rains hard and fast, it runs right in anyway.

  

[sjholbert]

This is wierd...that picture I attached (a couple of posts up) was taken Sunday when the algae was horrible.  I went to the lake last night (tues) and 90% of the algae was gone!  

It had been increasing in quantity for about 10 days.  During that time the weather had been hot and sunny.  Yesterday it was overcast and a little cooler (maybe upper 80s.)  I wonder if that made it die.

[jbougie]

2gofaster,

 Any way to post more information about the powdered dye?

 Right now we are using inthe spring roughly an initial 25 gallon hit of aquashade and then adding two gallons aweek.(we pump about 4 acre ft per week to maintain water level)

 What is everyone using these days

www.redrocklakeandland.com

[ForrestGump]

I'll get that info this week.  For the life of me, I can't remember where we got the powder dye from. 

[Director Darwin]

We get our powdered dye from Western Farm Service in Visalia, CA.  Met them at Nationals in Bakerfield a couple of years back.  The rep's name is Bill Galli.  His email is bgturf (at) yahoo.com

[Marco]

JD- How much does the powdered dye cost relative to a gallon of Aqua Shade or eqivalent?  We pay $45 +/- per gallon, and with water running into our lake constantly, it gets pretty expensive for the season.

[Horton]

Bill Galli’s daughter  -  he is a good guy and knows his chems.

 

[Director Darwin]

If I remember correctly, it's equivalent to $26/ gallon - much cheaper than Aquashade - that's what I used before as well.

[jbougie]

Gentlmen ( I am assuming there are no lovely ladies here)

 We are trying to form a Ski Lake Association here in Northern Ca.  Our main objective is to help everyone out in particular with chemicals and other related supplies.  Right now we are purchasing a gallon of aqua shade at $33 a gallon and thats when we are ordering enough for 3 lakes here locallay.  We now have 7 lakes joined up and are looking forward to getting more lakes to join to help increase our leverage.

 Anyone intrested.

 We are trying to maintain a real non-profit association level and keeping annual membership we believe in the $75-$100 range per lake.  This pays for our soon to be website, mailers and allittle bit of work to be done (hell maybe even a tshirt).

 Let me know

Jason Bougie

530-321-2035

jbougie@pacbell.net

www.redrocklakeandland.com

[billgalli]

Thanks Joe for the intro

Thanks John Horton for informing me of the posting

 The bottom line with the Mirage WSB is there is not much left.  They gave me a new replacement cost and it  will not be affordable. We have a limited supply of liquid at 08 pricing, I have been informed by our supplier that there will be a substantual increase for 09.

As for Algea, We have been promoting GreenClean Pro this year. Our customers love it. Its a granular product that just need s to be spread where the algea is and in 20 minutes you can see the results. It is a non copper product. It also super oxygenates the water to help speed up the decompisition of the algea so it does not come back as quick with another bloom.    www.biosafesystems.com

Bill Galli

559-287-3980

[Director Darwin]

Bill - that's not good news for those of us who use your products.  We have a small club and currently spend around $1200/year in dye.  If it goes up significantly, we'll have to look for other options in the marketplace.  Perhaps a group buy as referenced above would make it more profitable on the supplier end and affordable on the vendor end.

[Horton]

Hey Bill,

I skied really good in your "13 globule water" lake  last night but was wondering what it would take to change that lake to 11 globule water.

Horton

[billgalli]

We watch the costs of other products and the other products have already taken their prices up. The raw materials to build the products are up. Dye will still be the least expensive way to curtail weed and algea growth.

 Bill Galli 

[lkb]

Bill, how much does it cost to treat a lake with greenclean pro? Also, is there a dye that gives the water a more natural color than the bright blues I typically see while still blocking sunlight?

thanks

[skidawg]

When his price of dye gets to much to be cost effective I will start selling the chocolate milk dye we have in our lake, works like a charm and is really tasty with donuts

[Director Darwin]

I'll be over tonight to pick some up!

[billgalli]

The price increase will not be way out there for the liquid product, for those who have been long time customers know we have been able to hold the price for many years. The cost to treat an a lake I will need to know the details of the lake dimensions and the type of algae how bad is it. Bad news if the lake smells.

 

[Old MS Accout]

Bill,

I have about 2200x300 and about 18 million gallons of water to treat. Would you have a ball park cost on the green clean? We have clear water that after a big rain or early in the spring we get loaded with pospherous and then have a bloom. We knock it out with Cutrine Plus, but it comes back after a big run off.  

[lkb]

Bill, mine is 2200'X230'X7'.

[jbougie]

sweet!!  A how long is yours contest

 Ours is 2380X300X6

[billgalli]

The rates for GreenClean Pro arer 50-250lbs per miooion gallons of water. My experience will show 50-100lbs per million gallons will be in the range for heavy growth especially if the bloon has occured within in a couple of weeks rather than trying to clean up a pond that has not been treated in years. The cost for GC Pro is $1.92 / lb fob.  Minimum of $1800.00 for product.

 Western Farm Service/Agrium has purchased UAP. We are in transition of innergrating to large companies. It is my hope we will be able to ship from closer locations to save freight on some of these products.

 

[billgalli]

Note on GreenClean Pro; we only need to calculate the top 4 feet of the water volume. The algea only grows to that depth and the GC Pro disolves in the top 4 feet only. If there is a need to get it deeper then you can drag it in a burlap bag to get  algea off the bottom.